Why is religion in AA?
In this age of so many different religions and paths it really annoys me how AA has the word "god" referenced in their procedure to overcome alcoholism. I mean does this program not work for people who do not believe in God? Are they doomed for that reason?
I think there should be a re-write to the twelve step program due to the facts that so many people are forced to go to those meetings for justified reasons, such as DUI and so on. But to have to sit there and be apart of a "religious" program which could be against their beliefs is just insane.
You would think that the powers that be would step up and do something seeing they all complain about prayer in school and reference in politics about religion, well come on why are the little people paying again?
There is a better way and I believe that those who choose to step up and fix the system or program will realize that not only would a different program be beneficial to the system it would also create a much more positive environment.
I thought there were laws against people forcing others to"practice" a specific religion which they are not part of?
Also, is it not the "God" who is sitting at the last supper drinking wine? Is that not stating that it is allowed?
So in my opinion the program should be reworked to be politically
correct.
J.R. sr
7:59 am on Wednesday, December 28, 2011
A simple google search produced... http://www.aa.org/subpage.cfm?page=288
"A.A. had its beginnings in 1935 at Akron, Ohio, as the outcome of a meeting between Bill W., a New York stockbroker, and Dr. Bob S., an Akron surgeon. Both had been hopeless alcoholics. Prior to that time, Bill and Dr. Bob had each been in contact with the Oxford Group, a mostly nonalcoholic fellowship that emphasized universal spiritual values in daily living. In that period, the Oxford Groups in America were headed by the noted Episcopal clergyman, Dr. Samuel Shoemaker."
I am not a "God" believer (although I do feel that there IS something driving us through the universe), and feel that, people use "God" as a reason for things that they cannot explain (kinda like astrology), but this system was (it seems) founded on a principle of spirituality, something similar to the YMCA, I guess....
J.R. sr
8:33 am on Wednesday, December 28, 2011
Also, having been brought up Catholic (which I atribute to my current belief structure), you are taught that it is not ""God" who is sitting at the last supper drinking wine" but the "son of God" and (ask any Italian), drinking wine with dinner is not bad, but drinking wine with everything, is....
Lavender Green
4:19 pm on Tuesday, January 3, 2012
Thank You Justin for that wonderful information, I actually think the system needs to change seeing there are so many people who go to AA but are not "god" believers so would you not think that the times need to be change or another program that is not religious be available for those who have to go? Its just a thought
J.R. sr
10:25 am on Wednesday, January 25, 2012
or maybe, you can look past the "god" element of AA, and insert your own beliefs, look at what AA teaches, and use it to get past the problem. I am not a "believer" in any one "god" (I feel that there is something that moves us through space-time...call it fate, call it the force, call it "god...whatever you want....), but I am getting tired of the athiests with an agenda trying to force others to change because of THEIR beliefs.....It kinda sounds to my that you picked up a DUI and attending a court-mandated AA course....just go with it, fix yourself, and dont worry what others preach....
Lavender Green
11:43 am on Wednesday, January 25, 2012
I agree Jr for people to just fix themselves, and I am not an athiest either, actually i am a reverend, and with all those who i assist i hear many different views and love to hear what people say. But the most i get is that AA is mostly pushing the "god" issue, not that one should nor shouldnt believe but when its a manditory assistance for people who are "made" to go, mind you I am not a offender, it should be more generic and not put on the individual to change the subtitles. Its supposed to be a fair program one that is supposed to be useful.
Jeff Bohen
7:10 pm on Saturday, January 28, 2012
For a number of years AA has debated whether to change/not change the god reference in its literature to "Higher Power." Recently this was again the talk and scuttlebutt at the World Level of AA. And apparently, since I last checked, it was never changed.
One thing to note is that AA etc isn't the only game in town when it comes to recovery. Many I have come across, who are a bit more pragmatic about life and recovery, have chosen traditional therapy, Rational Recovery, Harm Reduction, or simply stopped on their own.
Contrary to popular belief-and there is a wealth of research on the topic- (See Harm Reduction for examples) people do stop on there own.
When AA was conceived our country was a bit more religious than it is today I would say. So it only seems natural from an sociological standpoint that religion would play a role.
If you talk with "12 Steppers" that will tell you its not a religious program -its a spiritual one-to which I point out the same folly, but for different reasons than you.The AA Big Book refers to "Our Creator" plenty which for this Darwinian is a bit over the top.
Lastly, those that are mandated to attend meetings have to do so usually for certain lengths of time i.e. 90 days, 6 months, etc... and the very least we, meaning the community, know that person is not drinking and driving and were all safer for that.
It is said in AA, "if you don;t accept god, you won;t get better. It would go down a bit easier if that was changed
Scott Johnson
1:26 am on Monday, January 30, 2012
Yea, the problem Jeff, is that you can be court ordered to attend AA meetings, Hopefully when courts in the future order someone to get help, they are pointed towards a spectrum of choices and not just AA.
Jeff Bohen
9:44 am on Monday, January 30, 2012
Yep I know-Strange thing about that is the Court see's AA/NA as "Treatment" when in fact it's not. Even AA recognizes this....
Back to the original point of the posting- the 12 steps (and its later companion the 12 traditions) are based upon spiritual principles-in other words each step has spiritual principle attached to it-Honesty, Hope, Faith, etc. These principles when one takes a closer look are derived the bible and Ten commandments. So for me when the idea is promulgated that 12 step programs are not religious in nature, I have to laugh.
Lavender Green
10:45 am on Monday, January 30, 2012
Yes Jeff, I agree, I have myself never sat in on an AA meeting but I as a writer of positive thinking would love to, I think it would be most enlightening, for others too, Because I as a reverend should believe in that proverbial god, but am more aware there are other things out there and if one is forced to go to something then it shouldn't be persuasive against something they do not believe in. I think the judicial system needs to reevaluate what they are sending people to, I mean if they are trying to make people religious then so be it, but I don't think law, politics and religion go hand in hand! Thank you for your thoughts... Lav